ENGL 360K Maymester 2006 (Archived) -

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Thu, 21 Dec 2006 14:49:54 -0500

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The Pine-Sol Lady has a name...

Wed, 7 Jun 2006 13:05:32 -0400

and it is Diane Amos. I looked for videos to no avail, but I did find an interview.

http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1077/is_4_60/ai_n9486292

It touches on her mother's feminist views, and apparently Diane is competitive too

I'm not technologically savvy at all, so posting pictures is beyond my scope, but if you Google Images of Diane Amos (and not the "Pine-Sol Lady") you'll find quite a bit.

I'm not sure if I see a physical resemblance, but, hey, that's just me.

Cheers,
Valyn

Vincent (13)

Tue, 6 Jun 2006 22:04:22 -0400

The Self chapter really opened my eyes to some burdens that common men may face. I, too, as Vincent had, pinned all straight, white, educated males as having it easy and not having any negative aspect about their societal identity. I really did find her intrusion in this chapter unacceptable, even in the name of her book, but it appears she did as well. By wanting Paul (Corey actually did) to cut her, it seemed like she was paying pennance. This was her Hail Mary for breaking trust on such an intimate level. It seems likely that some of the men in the group will read this book and recognize themselves, or atleast recognize Ned and be really pissed off about it. I'm sure they'll vent their rage in their healthy ways, but it's still injuring. As Darryl said in class, it's like unto rape for a woman. I think this is an exaggeration, but it's not too far off on the emotional scale. At first in reading this chapter, I thought, why is it fair that no women should be able to join? Men can join feminist groups and usually they find a mutually valuable niche. But in reading I realized they didn't allow women to join in order to avoid the type of judgement and scrutiny that plagued them, which I was already putting into place simply in reading about them. It's odd that a 'men's movement' involves therapy and huggy time (not to belittle it at all), and a 'women's movement' involves the arousal of more aggressive instincts and power. I guess it's nothing more than what comes from liberating two societally bound genders from their detrimental norms.

Vincent, pgs. 184-end

Tue, 6 Jun 2006 15:08:42 -0400

“...The most visionary task of all remains that of re-conceptualizing masculinity so that alternative, transformative models are there in the culture, in our daily lives, to help boys and men who are working to construct a self, to build new identities.” (p. 63-4, bell hooks, Yearning: Race, Gender, and Cultural Politics)

“Women see men as guarding the fort, so they don’t see how the culture of the fort shapes men. Men don’t see how they are influenced by the culture either; in fact, they prefer not to. If they did, they would have to let go of the illusion of control.” (p. 14, Susan Faludi, Stiffed: The Betrayal of the American Man)

Vincent (12)

Tue, 6 Jun 2006 13:36:21 -0400

It surprised me that three women still wanted to sleep with Norah Vincent when they found out that Ned was really a woman. I can't say that it wouldn't freak the hell out of me. I would be really angry if a love interest, male or female, had deceived me in such a huge way. I guess that might be a peculiarity I have. I guess I have a big fear of being lied to or deceived. Also, it surprised me that those women were so open to trying sex with a woman. Like I said, I can't say I would have been as open. I really think it was wrong that Norah deceived so many people in such a way in this chapter, and I didn't really find anything worthy of this deceit.

Vincent 184-287

Tue, 6 Jun 2006 07:51:25 -0400

Out of this nice chunk of section I think the part where Vincent is working as NEd really grabbed my attention. The men that he was around was definetly something else. I can't believe they just used women like they did and went on bragging about it. To talk of the girl, Tiffany, that was 18 and pregnant and she used it for all it was worth. I just thought this part of the book was terrible. There are some things that you just don't do. But I guess these guys didn't really care, being salesmen and all. THey would do anything to get a sale and make a buck. And it was sad to hear how little they made. I felt sorry for them but at the same time they should have known better. If these managers didn't have these poor little people going out and doing this sort of work for them there would be no company. They should all just quit and screw over the manager. Because who knows if they really were in your shoes one day or if they just started up this company because they knew that they could use people. All of them got used, wheither they wanted to admit it or not, they did. NEd knew it, did the others?

Self Helpless: Wherein Pete steals a blog entry title from Penn and Teller

Tue, 6 Jun 2006 01:57:27 -0400

Work is the chapter that impresses me most in regards to Vincent's ability to maintain her masquerade, because of her contempt for every hypermasculine, jingoistic aspect of the process she entered. Knowinginly going into a losing situation like that, working with phony wornout people in a phony worthless job for what amounted to no gain, its amazing that Ned managed to hold off on snapping as long as s/he did.

As soon as Vincent mentioned Men's empowerment groups my mind immediately flashed back to my innumerable high school viewings of Fight Club. "Bob had bitch tits." The chapter went downhill from there, mostly do to my own inability to take it seriously. "A generation of men raised by women" had summed it up succinctly several years before.

journal #13

Tue, 6 Jun 2006 00:50:36 -0400

Patrick Trainor

ENGL 360k

Blackmon

Journal 13

Journal #13

I found it interesting in the work chapter that Winterson chose sales and an office as the medium for her exploration of men in the workplace. I thought this was a bit odd because I don’t find working in an office or doing sales to be a stereotypical enough of a man’s job. It especially didn’t work for me because she and her coworkers were doing door to door sales work. I see those people as kind of slight weasel like shady characters. In my opinion it is not all that manly of a job. I really only respect people who are selling things door to door for fundraising purposes like the Boy Scouts etc., not for profit. I think that Winterson would have gotten a much more positive and better view of men in the workplace had she chosen to participate in a more stereotypical male career such as a firefighter, police officer, soldier, sailor, airman, or marine. I think by going into one of these stereotypically male fields she would have seen that real men are not the shady characters that she met in the office. Also, she would have seen the bond that exists between people in these lines of work stemming from the fact that their lives depend on one another. Winterson would have also gotten a lot more insight into the male friendship bond that she didn’t necessarily get from her time in the monastery. I realize that it would be pretty much impossible for her to get into one of these jobs because of the security implications etc. so those thoughts were just theoretical.

Journal 13 (Vincent 184-287)

Mon, 5 Jun 2006 18:50:25 -0400

ENGL 360K
Journal #13
Amanda Briden
6/5/06

Vincent (184-287)

Ms. Vincent –

I think in order to have had a more profound impact on me as a reader I would have liked to know whether or not, from the beginning of the project, you were going to tell everyone that you encountered you were a woman. It is my opinion that you should have decided to tell everyone or no one at all. Two reasons came to mind for why you did not tell the retreaters about yourself. The first you provided. You were scared of how they would react and thought that they could not emotionally handle the embarrassment they might feel after they had opened up to you. The second, one that I felt while reading, was that you established a closer connection to these men than other “subjects” you experienced as Ned. If I had been one of your “subjects,” one you told your secret to, and knew that you chose not to tell other “subjects” about your true identity, I would wonder why they were seemingly more privileged than I. I would think them more privileged because they would never know that they were used and deceived by a friend. They would not have to continue life in constant paranoia of whether or not the people they meet are really who they think they are or whether or not they are imposters. The bottom line from Amanda is that you crossed the line. You deceived and broke the trust of people you encountered.

Self Made Man The Movie: All of the monks will be played by Robin Williams

Mon, 5 Jun 2006 02:02:32 -0400

The dating chaptor was pretty painful to read, and the detailing of how self defeating the process can be is hardly motivating. How does a guy both develop the thick skin needed to keep going back for more abuse, but on the same token not end up so calloused by the process that he can't feel anything? Is the male "fear of commitment" in fact a delayed twitch in respose to prior beatings? Likewise, its disheartening to read Vincents analysis of the mindset of the women, that men are monsters until proven human. I find it confusing that women can be so vicious to one another in competition, yet still give each other more credit at first meeting than they would to any man on earth.

journal 12

Mon, 5 Jun 2006 01:48:48 -0400

Patrick Trainor

ENGL 360k

Blackmon

Journal 12

Journal #12

The book Self-Made Man got better to read for me in this last section that we read for Monday. It was very refreshing to learn of Winterson’s dealing with rejection. As a guy I could identify with that and feel her pain. Women in that situation are in the position of power. Society has dictated that men are to be the pursuers and women the pursued. This makes it hard on a man because when he approaches her he is at her mercy. Rarely is it the other way around because of how society is. In my experience it is much less nerve wracking when meeting women in a casual basis like in class or at the store or something because there is not the assumption that one or the other party wants anything out of it.

Journal 11

Mon, 5 Jun 2006 01:41:51 -0400

Patrick Trainor

ENGL 360k

Blackmon

Journal 11

Journal #11

The book Self-Made Man in the first section has been kind of boring to me since as a man I live through all the stuff that she is talking about as far as manhood is concerned. I don’t necessarily see the point of doing this experiment without it being legitimate research. I did, however, enjoy the two quotes from Shakespeare that preface the book. The quotes from Twelfth Night and As You Like it were very appropriate since both of those plays involve gender bending because of female characters taking the disguise of male characters. As a result bizarre romantic entanglements ensue such as in the case of Twelfth Night in which Viola (disguised as Sebastian) is in love with Duke Orsino, who is courting Olivia, who is in love with Sebastian (who is really Viola).

Journal 10

Mon, 5 Jun 2006 01:33:35 -0400

Patrick Trainor

ENGL 360k

Blackmon

Journal 10

Journal #10

I really liked the end of the novel Written on the Body. I liked it because the author doesn’t ever say if it is really Louise that is at the door, or if the protagonist is imagining that it is Louise from the intense memory that (s)he has of Louise. I like the idea that it actually is Louise more than the latter because I was really pulling for the main character to get back with Louise because I felt for him/her. Oh, and by the way I really hated the character Gail. She just seemed like this fat, disgusting woman who despite being told that the main character had no interest in her and was still in love with Louise felt the need to impose herself on the main character. I really just wanted to hit Gail and say get the hell out of here, no one wants you around. It was really nice when the real/imaginary Louise appeared at the end to displace gail.

Vincent, pgs. 92-183, & Butler, "Gender is Burning"

Sun, 4 Jun 2006 23:36:51 -0400

“I could partake at last in the assumption of heterosexuality and ask out any woman I liked without insulting her.” (p. 92)

Vincent’s chapter on love was intriguing. Performing the role of a man, she had to “get out there” and be the proactive one, making the first moves. The recurring theme was that Vincent, as a man - as every man - had to work double-time to prove himself worthy of the woman’s trust. “It was the woman’s job to be on the defensive, because past experience had taught her to be.” (p. 97) The women Vincent-as-Ned dated brought with them their past experiences and future expectations.

Vincent 92-183

Sun, 4 Jun 2006 23:04:19 -0400

Now this gets a little interesting. I was suprised at the fact that she wanted to infiltrate a monistary. It just seemed a little odd of a place to start, but then made perfect since. She should have done a little research on what men talk about, especially in that situation so she wouldn't have embarassed herself so. Yet she learned from it and got right back on.
I love how she tried to tell one of the Father's that she was in fact a woman, but he thought she(Ned) was just gay. He had so many questions about homosexuality, it made me wonder if he was gay as well. I mean he sounded like it, but who am I to stereotype? Maybe like she said, he didn't know. \